Lots of questions; am I too fat or too skinny?

I'm 193cm and weigh 73kg, which would be 6'4 160 pounds (I think? I'm European)
Supposedly I'm close to being underweight, but my body still looks "chubby." i.E I don't have the usually skinny guy look where the rib-cage is almost at full display.
I've been consuming 70g worth of protein everyday and following this program for a week: https://www.muscleandstrength.com/workouts/3-day-full-body-dumbbell-workout
I have to skip some of the bent over exercises because my back isn't strong enough yet.

Used to eat about one plate worth of food everyday or a single sandwich, I'm not counting the calories but I'm definitely in a surplus to meet my protein goal. Complete cold turkey on sweets for 4 years.
I don't wanna go to the gym because the last time I went my coach wouldn't let me use anything but machines for 3 months and I never got any stronger or fitter. So I just bought some dumbbells and I use the edge of my bed like a bench by lying diagonally for chest exercises.

Also that program includes no ab workouts, I physically can't do most of the ones I see on YouTube like Russian Twists. I can pretty much only do crunches. Would like some recommendations for beginners.

Also, should I eat more or less? Do I have enough body fat to get toned/stronger? Used to eat in the 800-1000 range and this week I'd estimate my calorie intake to be around 1200-1500.

I don't do any cardio at all, since it completely exhausts me for the day usually (I felt dizzy and nausea at the gym when my coach made me run for 30 minutes before starting my full body machine workout. Main reason I got burned out.)
Do I need to do cardio though? If so, what, and how often?

Looking to get lean first, if I still want to look stronger by that point I'll start hitting the gym to lift heavier, but I feel like a lean look should be achievable at home with just dumbbells.

>Some more background info
I used to be fat (188cm 95kg) when I was younger and went the starvation route to quickly lose weight

  1. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Hey anon,
    Sounds like u got bit too much bf%.
    I would start to bulk: eat a bit more calories than needed, much protein and go to gym. Start with whole body workout. In most gyms u can ask a trainer to put a plan together for u with excises and once work through it together to look if u do the excises right.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      I already talked about my experiences with trainers in the post, 3 months down the drain and I felt like shit.

  2. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Woah dude, only 800-1500 calories a day, that's...quite low for your height, even if you don't exercise daily. Either you miscalculated your calories or you have a body that stops going below a certain bf%
    Usually to get muscles growing you need to be in a caloric surplus (about 150-300kcal is enough if you don't want to bulk really fast).
    You can't really become lean and stronger at the same time (except if you use PED's).
    What are you aiming for, what are your goals?
    >Aim to become stronger.
    Consistency is key here + progressive overload
    Leave the machines behind and focus on big compound movements like deadlifts, squats, rows, ohp or/and bench (do them with good form and beforehand I would suggest to figure your 1 rep max)
    Calisthenics are always good if you lack time or equipment: pushups, situps, bodyweight squats, dips, and just basically hanging helps
    >Get lean
    Eat less but be active as it will help reduce muscle breakdown
    >Get buff
    Eat atleast 150g to 250g of protein daily, fill the rest of the calories with carbs and fats.

    Honestly there is no short answer my dude and there is tons of information that can be misleading
    Just be consistent with your training/food/sleep, always try to make new personal records

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >What are you aiming for, what are your goals?
      Something like pic related
      >Get lean
      >Eat less but be active as it will help reduce muscle breakdown
      That's what I don't get, what's less than a single 500 kcal sandwich per day lmao. Do I need to stop eating altogether?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        You could always fast but In my opinion I don't think you need to lose weight.
        No matter how skinny you are muscles will not pop if you don't have them.
        To get the physique in your picture you could easily do calisthenics and maybe in a year you'll have a similar body

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I already do intermittent fasting

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          I still consider myself a novice in sports and fitness but I'm always glad to extend a helping hand.
          Plus starting a fitness journey alone can be daunting
          Created a discord link: https://discord.gg/6YRUtchU
          Feel free to join if you want
          Feel free to join
          Created a discord server

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        dude your BMR is low because your muscle mass is low.

        gain some muscle, then cut. 73kg at your height is very little. the guy in your picture has a lot more muscle mass relative to frame size than you do, while having not that much less fat - if at all.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Usually to get muscles growing you need to be in a caloric surplus
      Funny. What's the literature on this? I'm not saying its wrong, but I've noticed that I've been building muscle at a caloric deficit. Eating ~60-80g of protein though at 71kg. Probably not building it as fast as I could, but that's beside the point. OMAD + one meal replacement shake and some foul green drink that gives me superpowers.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Okay, I found something interesting
        https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10838463/

        Apparently you can gain muscle mass on a caloric deficit, by taking extra protein. Not a lot, but it does happen. The cops who were on a caloric deficit and taking protein powder gained 2-3lbs of lean muscle mass over 12 weeks at 80% of their caloric needs.

  3. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Eat a lot more (like to the point that you are uncomfortable, eating should be treated like any other set you do.), get a gym membership, and do heavy and grueling squats. Within half a year you will be absolutely amazed at your results. You will probably gain a bit more weight in fat but you have barely any muscle at all so this really is the only fix (I’m not a doctor lol).

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      -me

      >I don't wanna go to the gym because the last time I went my coach wouldn't let me use anything but machines for 3 months..
      Stop wasting your time with dumbells you idiot. Just join a gym you start lifting like a normal person.
      Do not get a coach. WTF kinda gym was that anyway? I'd tell any "coach" to fuck off and leave me alone.

      Yeah what this guy said.

  4. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >I don't wanna go to the gym because the last time I went my coach wouldn't let me use anything but machines for 3 months..
    Stop wasting your time with dumbells you idiot. Just join a gym you start lifting like a normal person.
    Do not get a coach. WTF kinda gym was that anyway? I'd tell any "coach" to fuck off and leave me alone.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      this, random gym coaches are just memes to make normalfags feel like they belong, they won't actually teach you anything important

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Well normalfags are the ones getting all the attention from girls so gymbros are normalfags by default

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Found the manlet

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm OP, I wouldn't give a rats ass about lifting if it weren't for women only liking built bodies

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              hot, i also lift so i can break a girl in half

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              So I was right lol. You can’t be seething over women in your bedroom using newspeak words, it’s really lame. Get in the gym and lift for yourself and read something meaningful. Women will naturally follow. Nothing is lost if you work on yourself, you are already tall. As kids on tik tok say, “touch grass”.

            • 3 weeks ago
              Anonymous

              Goddam... it's grim to be a manlet, it's hard to not lose hope with such demoralization

              • 3 weeks ago
                Anonymous

                Hey at least you put on muscle mass faster. You'll just need to find a girl shorter than you and you'll mog the relative competition.

  5. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Eat more protein and lift, simple as

  6. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    skinnyfat, this was me at 190cm and 165lbs 4 months into lifting

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      How were you at the start? Fat, skinny, skinnyfat?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        skinny, there was barely anything to pinch on my stomach. I just had no muscles as I was 155lbs when I started

  7. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    You're skinny-fat. Eat some real food like steak, liver, eggs, and milk. Now go outside in the sunlight. Now pick up heavy stuff and put it down. Now play ultimate Frisbee with your friends. Congrats you'll be top 10% afterwards

  8. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >Retarded gay fell for the fasting meme because he's a lazy fuck and now wants to get in shape after fucking up his calorie intake...

    OP wtf, why aren't you eating at least double the protein and 2500-3300 kcal/day. You'll be a garden gnome forever if you keep this up.
    Also wtf do you mean you didn't get any stronger in 3 months? I'm almost sure you weren't eating enough nor pushing yourself hard enough.
    Hanging leg raises and the ab machine at your gym should be pretty good tho
    Also do cardio you fucking skeleton

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >>OP wtf, why aren't you eating at least double the protein and 2500-3300 kcal/day
      I can't, I'm gonna work my way up there though

  9. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    gonna have to triple your protein intake mate, at least get in above 193g a day

  10. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    You're skinnyfat and need muscle
    Do full body workouts 3x's a week (for now), something with less exercises/more compounds and a lower rep range.
    Get a barbell.
    You also need to eat a lot more calories/protein food to make up for the energy you'll be using
    Get a calorie counting app

    Basically you need a base of muscle to start and you're not fueling your body enough to do so

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Can I use my dumbbell weights on a barbell? It'd be cheaper since I already have 20kg worth of weights

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Do you live in the middle of nowhere? JUST GO TO A GYM YOU WONT MAKE GAINS WITH YOUR SILLY DUMBELLS.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        You need a lot more than 20kg
        Do your dumbells have weight plates that you can slip on or off? Or are they whole solid pieces?
        If they're plates, you have to measure the hole diameter to know if you need a standard or Olympic barbell. It's probably standard, which is good because they're usually cheaper.

        If the dumbbells are solid pieces, I suppose you could tie the weights to the bar, I've done that, but it's really not ideal. The weights move around and could slip off and kill something.
        If money is the issue, try to get a cheap set of weights with a standard barbell. It doesn't have to be great, things still have weight without looking pretty.
        Keep the dumbbells regardless though and add more weight to them as you progress.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          They're weight plates.

  11. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    You are the classic skinny fat. You don't have much fat on your body, but you have even less muscle, giving you a floppy look.

    You need to eat at least 3000 kcal daily and lift 3x a week. Dumbbells and calisthenics are a fine combination if you set things up right. Stop the dieting down shit, it will get you absolutely nowhere. Good luck

  12. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >am I too fat or too skinny
    you are both. you have too much fat and too little muscle.

    considering that you're extremely skinny you might actually want to start by building muscle. I started with a cut at a similar height because I was much heavier than you to begin with, while still in skinnyfat territory.

    I doubt you're likely to get very lean any time soon with so little muscle mass.

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