>SS
why is this shit 3x5, squat-focused meme program still being shilled to beginners?
It’s literally garbage even for a beginner routine, there’s way better programs for beginners out there and yet this board still seems to shill this garbage over other beginner programs
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I don't think it is shilled much nowadays. You should have seen how bad it was 10 years ago with the SS/SL shilling on here and Reddit.
Should be removed from the sticky
The sticky should be removed from the sticky. Seriously lots of dead links and other problems.
This lmao the sticky has been trash for a while. Fricking jannies not doing their job
you volunteering to do a complete rewrite of the sticky for free, anon?
if so then please submit on IRC when finished
I remember, in 2012 I was literally an eighth grader who had just moved over to IST after using /b/ and even as a noob 14 year old I realized SS was bullshit within like a week and switched over to a split
It’s not the compounds that make this routine bad, it’s the way they’re programmed
What would you do with all your knowledge if you had to start again?
lol I would probably just do my current routine even though it’s not necessarily a beginner program. but what I would realistically recommend for those just starting out is PPL for beginners for those looking to get into bodybuilding and 5/3/1 for beginners for those looking to get into strength/powerlifting
5/3/1, Greyskull or GZCLP are infinitely better than SS/SL
can you elaborate for a dyel?
Lmao same. I did 5x5s when I was in eighth and ninth grade and almost immediately switched to a PPL, and eventually a Reeves style full body split. Actually got jacked doing those, 5x5s is meme tier. And you deserve to stay small if you actually stay on it for more than a month.
Based and correct. I personally would have increased my volume sooner and hopped on the arnold (Back chest legs/ Arms version) split sooner and started smolov jr sooner. I would have probably been benching 405 when I was 18 had I done that.
Wait, what? What’s wrong with 5x5 linear progression? The issue with SS imo has always been the fact that you’re only doing 4 exercises and basically skipping back.
>4 exercises and basically skipping back.
DO YOUR POWER CLEANS
Power cleans are for explosiveness, not strength or hypertrophy. They have a place in some people’s training, but they’re definitely not the best choice for building a big strong back. The program does eventually include chin ups iirc though, which is good. Still not enough, I don’t know why he thinks beginners are supposed to wait a few weeks before training back directly lol
Does anyone on SS actually do the power cleans? I thought everyone who does it without a SS coach (which is 99% of people on SS) just swaps them for rows.
whats wrong with SL 5x5?
SL 5x5 doesn't give you much for what you put in. The progression of it is dumb and it is better used as an outline or inspiration rather than a strict guideline. After a month of S/B/Ds for 5x5s you should already know your real PRs and be able to do a real intermediate routine with enough hypertrophy like PPL or PHUL.
You get way better gainz as running pyramids, drop sets, and 5x10s and in a shorter workout session than running meme tier 5x5s.
As an elite powerlifter I haven't run a 5x5 in years, because it's honestly the worst of both worlds, not enough hypertrophy, not enough volume for CNS training.
Shane Hunt, an actual elite powerlifter (2160 lb total) posts videos doing 5x5s all the time. I’m going to trust him over you, sorry anon.
>be able to do a real intermediate routine
> like PPL or PHUL.
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHA
He's right. Both are infinitely better for putting on mass
>and be able to do a real intermediate routine with enough hypertrophy like PPL or PHUL.
subtle anon
It was created by some internet marketer piggy backing the SS popularity
I thought the basic compound lifts were pretty good for like 3 months?
worked for me lol
of course it did, going outside and lifting heavy stones is gonna work compared to doing absolutely nothing, that doesn’t mean it’s the best way to optimize beginner gains
I dunno I got to a 420 x 5 squat on SS worked bretty gud better than stones probably lol
>I got to a 420 x 5 squat on SS
I did. I'm
. Sorry, but it's possible. 🙂
>SS
>only squats once a week
holy shit how are you this moronic, ask me how I can tell that’s not you and you’re just a pathetic larper
> "I got to 420 x 5 on SS"
> squatting 530 x 3 in the video
it's almost as if he isn't doing SS anymore
I have no fricking clue why some people train legs that much
Do you do another leg day with machines or just do squats once a week for glutes and quads?
>completely missing the point
never said lifting stones was better than SS, just using it as an analogy for how SS isn’t even close to the most optimal beginner program
also there’s no way you hit a 4pl8+ squat with SS lmfao, think of a better lie next time
based riceball dabbing on dyels.
SS also worked for me. I ended up becoming stronger then most people in the gym from just 5-6 months of lifting. You can say any beginner can go in and do anything and make gains and that is just not true. So many people go to the gym and make no fricking progress at all
>why is this shit 3x5, squat-focused meme program still being shilled to beginners?
Because it makes rippetoe money, and his shills think its
>bazed and le red pillzed training
>way better programs for beginners
Don't know about way better. It doesn't really matter what they run as long as they go to the gym.
My problem with SS is its billed as some wellbeing program but does nothing for mobility, cardiovascular endurance, upperbody strenght, etc
>My problem with SS is its billed as some wellbeing program but does nothing for mobility, cardiovascular endurance, upperbody strenght, etc
It's billed as a beginners strength programme, anyone who tries to claim it's anything more than that is moronic. There are better ones I think but at least at three days (rather than the 6 of ppl that most people recommend) you at least have time to do those other things
>anyone who tries to claim it's anything more than that is moronic
So rippetoe and everyone else that shills it as a way to end the suffering of old people?
got it
Old people are not beginners?
They are. My point, which you completely missed, was that Rippetoe doesn't bill it as only a beginner strength program to these people.
What does he bill it as?
Imagine thinking you know more than someone who's been training people for decades.
It's not even that it's just a basic inability to think
Every criticism is moronic
There is no way to make faster size and strength gains than running up your squat, deadlift, bench, and press as high as possible as efficiently as possible, and that is literally all SS does
It's real, real hard though and I think that is the main reason people hate it. That and residual Weider bodybuilding thinking.
Ss is moronic. Any beginner program with more periodization is more intelligent. Forcing power cleans on beginners who can't even front squat is dumb. The diet is what makes it especially moronic.
> then don't do the diet
Ripplebreasts would scream "ur not doing tha progrham!!"
Why spend 6 days and 100s of sets to accomplish less than you could in 3 days and 20 sets?
The best routine Rippletoe ever came up with for your average incel (ie his entire audience base) that wants to start lifting was a variation on SS called practical programming novice routine that's tucked away in one of his books.
Monday and Friday
3x5 squat
3x5 bench / ohp alternating
3xF chins / pull ups alternating
Wednesday
3x5 squat
3x5 bench / ohp alternating
1x5 deadlift
The best warm up is taking your work set of the days weight and doing 40% of it for 5, 50% for 5, and 60% for 3. Then doing your 3x5. This warm up is taken from one of jim wendlers 531 books, probably the first one.
Just do that for like 3 months until you stall out and then start an intermediate program. All the fricking around and adding exercises at certain weeks is just ripplebreasts overcomplicating things and trying to sell more books to morons. And powercleans are completely pointless if you aren't an athlete.
You gays always say there are better beginner programs but I never see a single one suggested
531 for beginners
Reddit PPL
Lyle McDonalds generic bulking routine
GZCLP
Upon reading the programs, they barely seem different from the 3 phase of the SS beginner program. Can you explain what makes them better exactly?
Do they somehow alleviate the below average genetics beginner trainee from needing to sleep 8 hours, gain bodyweight, rest 5+ minutes between sets, use 2-5 lb fractional plates or do sets of 4 , 5 or 6 reps in order to lift heavy numbers and gain muscle size?
Perfect thread.
Having my first day at the gym next week. Apparently every starter routine I've read about is trash. Recommend me a good one.
I will NOT be reading a 10,000 word essay. I will NOT buy your dumbass book. That will be all.
Greyskull lp
lol greyskull is such a dogshit program with 0 volume. sucks how many beginners got memed into it.
Are you moronic? You're SUPPOSED to add accessory exercises to required ones!
unironically starting strength if u are a neet loser
Starting strength.
PPL for beginners if you care about hypertrophy, 5/3/1 for beginners or greyskull LP if you care about strength
>SS is a mem...
This kid can put four fricking plates over his head as a natty thanks to SS and Rippetoe.
Apologize right now.
I only count three plates
Wait is that legitimate form? I bet I could add 20 pounds to my max OHP if I let myself have that kind of back arch, but I keep it with a healthy posture arch and insanely squeezed glutes
>insanely squeezed glutes
L O N D O N
O
N
D
O
N
standing benchpress?
Beginners are literal piles of dough with no muscle or coordination. It makes sense to get them started on a simple program of a few basic compounds to build a foundation of strength and neurological development. Long term it's a shit program.
why not just start with pushups and hindu squats and cardio so their joints aren't shit before they even start
Pushups and free-weight squats are shit for people who are beginners, you say "this is better for your joints" when you suggest extremely joint-intensive training.
What a beginner should do is walk around for a few hours and focus on their mind-muscle connection and hyper-focus on their breathing.
You teach a newbie proper breathing technique and they will naturally assume proper form for most exercises, frick this counting bullshit, frick hopping from machine to machine and having 20+ different exercises a session, just move your body and don't stop
Let me play Dungeon Master for a bit and give a random encounter for your fitness program
A wild obese person comes in to the Gym where you work, they're already drenched in sweat and they stink profusely, and all they've done so far is walk from their car to the front desk of the gym.
You suggest body weight squats and pushups, they comply and promptly snap their wrists and blow out their knees, GG you lose
I'm pretty much intermediate upper/advanced lower now and still do 3x5 sometimesbut more like in the way to th old coolcicada ppl was set up, it's a nice setXrep scheme sometimes for heavy compound lifts nothing is wrong with it just do some other shit for volume afterwards.
I always liked starting with volume then going to one rep maxes
I did the test one day, lifted 1 plate for around 10 minutes, jumped to 3 plates, crushed the fricking lift EZ mode
Next day I try 3 plates right out of the gate, my spine was all curved and it hurt like frick
Lesson: Warm up you frick
SS is literally just something you do for a couple months to build up a shit ton of strength if that's all you want. It does exactly what it says it will do.
morons on here seem to think that all exercise will lead to them being lean with a six pack and huge muscles with nothing in between, and judge every program based on what immediate results they get towards that goal. They would say a powerlifter routine is a bad routine because it doesn't do what a bodybuilder routine does, instead of just doing a bodybuilder routine.
SS gets shit because it gets recommended for everyone who's starting out even if they don't give a shit about powerlifting.
>all these reddit replies
>reddit
https://www.reddit.com/r/StartingStrength/
>SS gay makes a moronic image
>I-If I call something r-reddit then it’ll make me right
literally nothing to base that image on, unironically was made by a lifting newbie
I've been doing SL for a few months now, and I've defintiely made some progress. I was pretty skinny and unathletic when I started, but should I just switch to GZCLP now? It seems way better. I usually do hypertrophy sets of 4x10 when I deload the weights anyway.
>70 posts
>still no consensus on what the best beginner routine actually is
I'll just do SS then I guess
Most of the autism going around about programs literally doesn't matter for beginners. Just do compounds to hit most of the muscles and lift more weight each session than the previous.