>Attacker can't be significantly bigger than you
>Attacker must be alone
>Attacker can't be carrying a gun
>Attacker can't be carrying a blunt object
>Attacker must have zero or less martial arts/fighting experience than you
Learning to run really fast and avoiding bad areas seems more effective, faster and cheaper.
If the opponent picks up a stick, you'll also have to pick up a stick to not be at a disadvantage. Now you're both forced to fight with sticks and most of that time you spent polishing your kicks in the ring becomes a waste.
No, but the majority are.
The best martial art you can learn for all around protection and fighting is Judo.
Not boxing, not wrestling, not BJJ, not krav, none of those. Judo. If you can, try no gi. But standard Judo is perfect.
Mind elaborating on why you think it's Judo?
Because throwing someone is leagues greater than trying to knock someone out with a punch.
This. There's nothing a powerful kick can do that can't be replicated by a layman swinging a shovel, however a Judo throw can deliver a blow that can't be found anywhere else-
Not only that, but courts actually look upon it more FAVORABLY than knocking someone out with a punch or kick. It demonstrates that you actually have good control over yourself and your ability to physically deescalate a dangerous situation. Your DA literally points to you the fact of how you decided to perform a formed and physically coherent takedown instead of trying play fisticuffs and a judge and jury will actually look at that and go, "yeah that makes sense."
That's amazing. Can I beat my friend who does Muay Thai if I have a few months in Judo?
What kind of silly reasoning is this?
If you judo throw someone on hard concrete, theres a strong chance they will crack their head and end up hospitalized, a vegetable, dead.
No judge will think, "oh, that young man performed good control of force by slamming someones head into the pavement".
A judge might not, but a jury is composed of your "peers" which is to say random TV-brained morons. A lot of judges are also morons.
Because you poses skills to defend yourself instead of haphazardly throwing you arms around.
>theres a strong chance they will crack their head
HAHAHAHA
you have never been in a fight
I want to do martial arts but I have shoulder and knee problems. Is Judo doable for somebody with fricked up joints?
Shoulders and knees? Not sounding too good tbh. As a judoka, your shoulder injury will be a problem
damn.
Does anybody know a martial art that's good for people with fricked up joints?
That's nice, but I can throw people with my back and shoulder muscles because I'm not the aiE of a small child. I can see why Judo would be good for you though.
Don't worry, fighting a judoka (or any grappler, really) will make you feel like a small child soon enough.
>*sprawls on you*
lol bye
What did he mean by this?
oh yeah you're definitely losing the fight
homie the first stand-up grappling technique I learned was the double leg takedown, the second one was how to defend against it, AKA how to sprawl.
>oh, you know karate? *mae geri* lol nothing personell kid
How much brain damage did your dad give you before he left to fetch milk?
Agreed
If you can throw someone to the ground it leaves you in better position to run away or disarm them
Better than risking in a punch that may or may not knock him out.
This doesn't make sense to me.
Go the gym, and load up a barbell with 100 pounds. That isn't easy to throw. It doesn't get easier when the huge mass you are throwing is resisting your attempts to throw it.
I go to a BJJ class, and we often do take downs and start our training standing on our feet. This could be an artifact of being in a class, but most every take down or throw leads to both people being on the ground together. I have watched Judo tournaments. Both Judoka end up on the ground together.
Throwing someone onto the ground against their will and not ending up on the ground yourself seems pretty ambitious.
As a teenager I fought against somebody who did judo tournaments. Having 20 kg of body mass on him made it very difficult to hold me, let alone throw me. I can't say if he was holding back or not, but he certainly didn't overwhelm me and we both renewed up walking away after a few minutes.
the weight isnt as much an issue as the relative size.
if he's 200, and you're 250, thats not as crazy a reach as if he's 150 and you're 200.
all about how you train. plus this is about self defense. Unless someone is already swinging at you, a surprise shoot is going to be escalating a conflict. And if you do that, you might be making a bad assumption about the other person's capabilities, including their natural strength regardless of training. You could get knocked out just because they have better reaction and tag you coming in.
or this if its not your day
It was something like 120 lbs vs 160.
judo is a sport tho. And they don't train you on how to deal with flailing limbs as you close in, or educate you that you might eat one on the way in.
check out that kneesovertoes guy for joint rehab strategies first, maybe
BJJ takedowns are made with the intent of following up with a lock or striking, so it makes sense you end up on the ground with them in a roll.
Judo's goal does include taps, but overwhelmingly the goal is the Ippon, which is something like "a decisive or dominant throw." and if the throw is into concrete, not a mat, its downright deadly. Just watch some of these. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eWuuNae2Ew
Also, like BJJ takedowns, its less about overpowering and more about setting up the body position so that they either go over or get hurt trying not to go over.
>BJJ takedowns are made with the intent of following up with a lock or striking, so it makes sense you end up on the ground with them in a roll.
You are disagreeing with me, but you just posted a video of Judo ippons where 90% of them involve both people going down to the ground.
Thats all I am trying to say. It is not realistic to think you can just throw someone onto the ground, and they will end up on the ground and you wont. Most any throw is going to involve you and your opponent on the ground, which is not clearly a safe conclusion to a self defense situation.
wasn't saying you'd never end up on the ground, just that its not the goal. of the throws you end up, lets say not on your feet, you aren't tied up with your opponent like you tend to in BJJ. You can just get up.
and you can still do that in BJJ depending on the takedown. You land in a superior position, just get up. But if you don't train right, the BJJ takedowns may not have the impact that their Judo versions do, so how much that helps depends entirely on your moveset and goals.
> you aren't tied up with your opponent like you tend to in BJJ. You can just get up.
Oh yeah. Look at this clean and beautiful Judo throw where one person was definitely thrown into the ground and the other person could cleanly separate themselves and simply walk away.
I didn't cherry pick this throw. I just picked a random one from the video you posted.
NTA but absolutely true that a lot of judo throws go to the ground, but it's also true that high level judo is going to look a lot different from judo vs the general population who has no idea how to intelligently defend a takedown. When you're bad at judo, going against a serious competitor makes you feel like a little kid trying to wrestle his dad. Like you have no say in where the fight is going to take place.
That said it is silly that people hype up "a big judo throw on concrete" as the end-all-be-all of fighting. Takedowns can be really good for ending fights quickly and controlling Exactly One Guy, but anyone treating them as a one size fits all tool just shows that they haven't trained seriously. If some crazy guy is following you down the road coming at you and you can't deescalate, you're probably better off with a solid jab cross and immediately fricking off than catching a manslaughter charge osoto gare'ing him through the sidewalk or getting further tangled up with an unstable dude. I like judo and muay thai as a combo because people are going to have a really hard time getting you off your feet unless you decide to take the fight there.
But that’s wrestling as well…
Brainlet take, but I haven't seen any good bait for a while so you'll do.
There is literally no downside to learning effective martial arts. Especially if you're an Europ00r and live in a nanny state where you aren't allowed to carry as much as a Swiss army knife (ironic). If you consistently do alive training against resisting opponents, not only will you know what to do if you're attacked, but you'll also be more mentally equipped to deal with the threat. You've experienced violence in a controlled, disciplined environment, that's as good as you can get when it comes to preparing for an actual violent situation. Not to mention most criminals are opportunists who prey on the weak, fight back enough and they just might back off before someone ends up dead. Not ideal, but c'est la vie.
Running or otherwise removing yourself from a dangerous situation is, of course, always the best choice. But sometimes it's not an option. My GF was a victim of a violent home invasion some years before we met. The trauma still causes her to freeze up when faced with a threat. Now, she weighs less than my OHP 1 rep max so I could just carry her I guess, but if there's a situation where I can't get her moving and someone is about to come down on either me or her, I'll stand and fight. A man has to be able to defend his woman, it's better if you know how.
Osu!
Actually the best would be boxing + judo since literally every streetfight on YT is showing throwing hands, then standup grappling.
Also boxing + judo was literally the combat method of choice for everyone in WW1, WW2 and the Cold War.
oh to be an old timey American boxer studying the exotic art of Kano Jiu-Jitsu
>boxing
frick off grandpa, muay thai or kickboxing + sambo are much better since you can also kick, knee or even elbow someone + still being able to throw someone the frick to the ground
Not him but you’re a moron. The vast majority of street fights boxing will serve you better than any other martial art. Your post just screams coping try hard
>have 4 limbs
>won't use 2
boxing is literally the same shit as bjj, moron, being saved by the rules because their opponents can't just kick their legs out
You're dangerously close to redditor levels here, but I'll chalk it up to stupid teenager who loves being contrarian and logical
People like you should get hit by a hard low kick. I bet on my grandmas life that you wouldnt be able to walk after it hit you. Low kicks causes so much pain while immobilizing you without causing you any harm + you have longer reach than your arms. The only way to block it is by checking it (Needs training). If you think im somehow bullshitting you, go to a muay thai gym and ask someone to low kick you and you will realise how much of a dumb ignorant homosexual you are. Muay thai is also superior in close combat when someone is clinching you, you are trained to use your elbow,knees,sweeps etc and have actual practical experience during sparring.
Track and field, plus marksmanship are best for self defense.
If I am not American, what would be the closest to this? Getting good at rock throwing?
Mace? I don't even recommend knives for self defense, because it's easy to fumble it under the pressure of being attacked and the attacker now has your knife. Mace them and bolt. Or mace them and kick while their down but the spray tends to stay in the air so you may get teary eyed as well.
OP I think people just do martial arts for sport.
"Self defense" is really a combination of threat avoidance, conflict de-escalation, in rare cases running and maybe once or twice in a lifetime you will need to grapple.
Anybody who gets attacked regularly is responsible for putting themselves in those situations. They're doing it for sport
I agree, but some people genuinely think martial arts are good for self defense.
If anything, experience in martial arts (specifically experience in martial arts that include sparring, boxing/kick boxing/muay thai) will allow someone to be able to think calmly during such situations and react accordingly. Thats about it.
Most self defense situations arent a fist fight, unless youre a highschooler.
Will it really? Most martial artists I've heard talk about the subject say that street fights are completely different from arranged ring fights.
Not gonna watch the video, sorry.
>street fights are completely different from arranged ring fights
They are. But that doesnt change the fact that people who practice martial arts with full contact sparring will have sharpened reaction times and the ability to think calmly under such situations.
If they are being swung at by two people, they can most likely avoid the hits, then run away.
If they are being swung at with a knife, they can most likely avoid the knife, then run away etc.
Maybe you're right, I don't really care to look up the answer haha.
One of my childhood best friends was a martial arts fanatic. But it didn't do shit for him when a pack of MS-13 gang members broke into his house to steal his weed stash and stabbed him to death. The only thing that would have saved his life that night was a gun and sane immigration policies.
not useless, they will cover your bases, but there are much better options for most self defense scenarios
like a gun, or being able to book it, of not getting yourself into trouble.
Most proper martial artists today who can beat the frick out of stronger people dont do it for self defense but because its fun, its great training, and you get to meet some of the best bros you'll ever meet.
>getting launched by a dude 60kg lighter than you despite having a dominant position
was watching that israelite icy mike, on youtube, the other day.
he made the point that in a stressful situation you will tend to default to what you have trained to do.
so if you trained boxing and you're confronted with a dude with a knife: you might stand and fight when what you should have done is run away.
that yelling "fire" or "i don't know you" or some shit would probably be a good idea but very few people train to do that so when it happens they don't do it.
darker part of that vid was she showed that towelhead stabbing kids in strollers, in france, and pointed out all that "mama bear" shit women say about protecting their kids will not happen irl in a crazy situation.
The moral of the story is don't live arounds nigs/crackheads and theres nothing to defend yourself from
>Attacker can't be significantly bigger than you
there are martial arts that can overcome significant strength differences tho
>Attacker must be alone
some martial arts address dealing with multiple attackers
>Attacker can't be carrying a gun
knock him/her out before he/she can draw
>Attacker can't be carrying a blunt object
lol there are plenty of martial arts that can BTFO somebody who has a bat
>Attacker must have zero or less martial arts/fighting experience than you
"martial arts are useless because if somebody is better than you at martial arts, they will kick your ass"
that video of the roidtroony slav in the nightclub just walking around heeming every single person he sees, and no one stopping him disproves whatever bullshit you're blabbing on about. if even one of those guys in the club knew how to fight they could have put that guy down. you never know when you're going to end up in a situation where a guy wants to frick you up and you dont have a gun or an escape route.
The only guy I've known who has a. Been in multiple life or death fights and b. actually studied martial arts would tell me studying only one is useless. Take the good stuff from multiple and dont be moronic, stay out of trouble. Any knife/gun/fist fight you participate in means you're going to get hurt. Fortunately people are pretty bad at fist fighting naturally. Seriously we're the only predator species who has to "study" to kill something.
>Are martial arts useless for self-defense?
no, but like you're pointing out, it is highly situational on how useful it can be.
>Attacker can't be significantly bigger than you
if they are more than about 30% your size, your fighting success drops off very sharply. But its not impossible, anything can happen in a fight.
>Attacker must be alone
thats conditional. If a group attacks you, MA won't make as much a difference in overcoming them. But if a group is just present, a decisive clash can easily make the stragglers less likely to step up.
>Attacker can't be carrying a gun
not true automatically. But the stakes are way higher, so teasing the details out of this have questionable wisdom.
>Attacker can't be carrying a blunt object
depends on your training. A fist or an arm is a blunt object too, you don't have to alter your training too much if its not an edged tool.
Self-defense is illegal in tons of countries and in the countries where it's "legal" you have to spend a million dollars on lawyer fees because they treat it as guilty until proven innocent. This is why you should minmax lethal self-defense and absolutely do not follow cop advice of "call them early to let them know :*~~" Since we're not calling the cops, a simple knife will do for most cases while not causing a shitload of 911 calls like gunfire will.
>but I can simply shoot you
So if the guy already has a gun drawn and aimed at you, a gun is just as useless. Statistically, most self-defense cases occur with each party being within 3 meters of each other. Police training teaches how it's impossible to stop a knife attacker if they're moving with intent and they're in under 15 feet to you and their weapon isn't drawn already.
>but it's not a lethal scenario it's just a bar fight
First off, you're a low IQ Black person if you get into bar fights and deserve your future prison sentence. Second, you can easily adjust this to be less than lethal by using something heavy and blunt to stun the guy. Cover your face and immediately leave. Do not get into shit like this around people that can identify you.
one theory i heard is you should have pepper spray and a rock or a piece of rebar, or something.
you spray them then beat their brains out and say the rock/rebar/whatever is something you found at the scene.
since the spray has a much stronger connotation of being a defensive item than an offensive item.
actually now that i think of it - this wasn't self-defense advice. it was offense advice.
the most made up shit i've ever heard in my life
lol
https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/bldcontenten/belastingdienst/customs/safety_health_economy_and_environment/safety/weapons_and_ammunition/#:~:text=The%20Wet%20wapens%20en%20munitie,of%20the%20Netherlands%20with%20them.
to add, if you have a gun and you shot someone here, you will unironically be charged for that
So, Apache knife, Fairbain-Sykes, or Kali/FMA?
The only useful martial art are those that involve grappling. Things like Judo and Akido were actually used historically in combat and using your opponents height to send them into the ground will do a lot more than trying to actually fist fight them.
Neither aikido nor judo were ever used in combat. Both were founded in the 20th century, well after the meiji restoration when swords were outlawed aside from police. Even late sengoku-jidai was dominated by firearms, archery and spears.
You need to go back much further to the likes to tenjin-shinyo-ryu jujutsu if you want to make that argument.
How to be a better fighter than vast majority of the population without dedicating your entire life to martial arts:
>Be an adult male of above average height and weight
>Pick one grappling style and one form of striking. Both must regularly spar against fully resistant opponents but otherwise which ones you pick don't matter.
>Do whichever one you like more for a minimum of 2-3 years and whichever one you like less for a minimum of 1 year.
>Think about it like you're getting a degree in fighting. You don't have to be an expert in everything, but you're gonna want a major and a minor.
>If you don't want to keep doing it after that time, just stay in shape and drop in every so often to keep your muscle memory fresh.
Congratulations, you can now handle yourself against the vast majority of the population until someone picks up a pointy object and you die anyway.
>But that's a long time
Yeah, no shit. Do you think you would be good at basketball if you just learned "a few basketball moves" from your buddy and never actually practiced, let alone played? You have to actually do it a lot.
>But boxing doesn't have kicks and wrestling doesn't have submissions and bjj doesn't have takedowns and
This isn't going to make you an amazing fighter with no holes in your game. The point to having striking and grappling is you need to be able to win with one and not automatically lose to the other. You won't learn kicks from boxing but it doesn't matter when the average person hasn't even thrown a punch.
>But a gun is more effective for self-defense
Yeah, no shit. But fighting is fun and it's nice to have an intermediate option between complete inaction and deadly force.
There are essentially zero aikido schools that practice any form of live sparring against fully resisting opponents, and the handful that do are just doing shitty judo.
If I care mostly about having the lowest injury rate/risk, and secondly on having the lowest training intensity-recovery demand, both in order to have the least negative impact on strength/size training and training longevity, which style(s) would you recommend?
I did Muay Thai for 6 months but in that time a badly cracked rib (6 weeks off) and a few slight ankle issues. Admittedly some guys sparred harder. But also everyone doing it had some kind of injury on or off.
wrestling or sambo
I misread that you don't care about injury, both wrestling and sambo can be quite dangerous, just do bjj or karate, they are quite safe and injuries are relatively low
>Learning to run really fast
Muggers will be more athletic than you, that's why they choose you as a victim in the first place.
yeah, funny how morons with zero cardio will talk about how you should run fast instead of learning how to fight AND gaining the cardio to run fast
Is there any point in learning a martial art if I’m 5’7? I’m doing boxing but literally any fat guy could just tackle me or something
>you mean there's no secret, mystical, fighting art I can learn that will make me invincible!?!?
I'm afraid it's true.
god imagine rolling with her and feeling her body and smelling her armpits
Yeah imagine you tried a leg lock on her and she start pushing her free foot into your face to break free hahaha that'd be terrible
Most are useless yes.
Some are designed around more contact, those are generally better
All get mogged by one's focused on practical combat drills with partners using multiple skill sets
Generally:
1-1 = Dealers Choice
1-2 = Grappling bad, Kick boxing good
1-3 = kick boxing + muai thai good
Don't get stuck on technique or correct style.
Focus on fundamentals:
Enemy movement, foot work, range, making opponent angry. These serve you better than half knowing conversation over specific fighting styles.
learn boxing and bjj and carry a knife. With the skills of boxing, you will be able to go in and out of your enemy, without being touched. You will have reflexes to avoid other attacks. If the guy grabs you or brings you to the ground, bjj will help you to get up again or get into a better position. You don´t need to learn to throw. Just learn to not get thrown and get up quickly (you will also learn throws and take downs in good bjj schools). You also learn to imobilize the arm of your opponent.
Now comes the most important part. The knife. Get one like pic related. Some stiff blade, that is pointy and sharp. The knife is invisible, can´t be stopped, has unlimited ammo (unlike a gun), can´t be grabbed (unlike a gun), is easy to carry and hide, and the pure touch cause horrendous damage.
A blade is also a tool, while a gun is always a weapon, so its easier to explain in court, why you were carrying a knife.
Also, a knife is way cheaper and more silent than a gun. Its harder to track back, who attacked who with the weapon
You will NOT insult my judo waifu. I will pick up judo this semester and throw any disagreeing one to the ground like a tub of lard.
blowjobjitsu > all since criminals is big gay
>attacker must be alone
Thats what you got wrong, actual martial arts teaches you how to fight multiple people.
Sports like mma and boxing is the controlled thing that doesn't translate well in a real fight.
this, I learned it in this documentary about gun-kata
you can´t fight multiple attacker at once. Only sport-martial-arts help in a real fight. All those wannabe martial art system like wing chun or krav maga don´t work at all
You definitely can fight multiple people at once. Will it be hard? sure. But as uncordinated as you are likely they are just as uncordinated. If you get put on your back and they start stomping you its game over though.
Can confirm. I was once jumped by 4 guys and I simply poked all of them in the eyes as I was taught to do in my krav magafu class. I believe my attackers all trained MMA, as they all tried to imanari roll my legs simultaneously, which as you can expect is completely inapplicable to a real street fight.
> Carry a weapon.
> Improvise a weapon.
> Run.
> All martial arts are meant to be trained with a weapon as a side unlike combat sports.
Martial arts train your muscule memory to be able to do things in the spur of the moment. Sure if you get grabbed up from behind and get a gun put between your cheeks and they threaten to blow your dick off you're screwed.