This >China literally carrying the future of western civilization through their hair restoring magic >yakubian apes seeth, fume and mald while destroying their innocent balloons
The eternal whitoid
GT200029 might still go systemic and if it does the side effect profile would be way worse than any 5-ar inhibitor. Some people already report side effects on pyra/ru (heart, libido) despite both having low systemic absorbtion.
this literally kills the dht receptor right?if it went systemic it would be like a Fin Nuke,unparalleled to any Fin sides anyone has ever felt and would be permament.
It destroys androgen receptors, so for both testosterone and DHT. You obviously don't want that shit to go systemic since that would be equivalent to nuking both your DHT and testosterone levels. >and would be permament.
The body would recover the androgen receptors in a few weeks but yeah it wouldn't be a good experience.
Imo most non-mental sides from fin are probably from increased estrogen levels (less DHT conversion means more estrogen conversion after all). Dut can also cause additional side effects because DHT type 1 is probably important in some bodily processes (fin doesn't inhibit type 1 DHT) but the side effect profile is still low, just like with fin.
If the new GT20029 drug doesn't go systemic, it would be a great additional to traditional 5-AR inhibitors and cause massive regrowth. But if it does go systemic, I wouldn't touch that stuff even with a long stick.
Yeah I got off fin after like a year and a half. Only took it once every 2 or 3 days. When I got off my athletic performance went up quite a bit. Also felt more adventurous, desire for going out and trying new things increased. Shit is fricked.
1 year ago
Anonymous
Everything is a risk reward calculation. I haven't had any issues with fin but even if I had, I would still take it because dealing with that is still preferable to looking into your mirror and seeing decay.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Shit is fricked.
Nope, DHT is a based molecule.
I don't think I have the sensitivity genes. Hair looking good at 31. Never really tracked so hard to tell if there's a big difference from when I was 20. And even if, I'd accept it because DHT does so many other important things both mental and physical.
1 year ago
Anonymous
DHT, for the most part, is a trash hormone. >I'd accept it because DHT does so many other important things both mental and physical.
Kevin Mann has an entire series where he trashes DHT with science.
1 year ago
Anonymous
With "science". Dude is deep in the cope zone. I get it, we all make sacrifices for vanity. But at least be man enough to own up to them
1 year ago
Anonymous
>With "science".
How are the studies he cites wrong? He's always using high quality randomized, placebo-controlled human studies. >But at least be man enough to own up to them
Shaving it isn't owning up anything. Growing it out would be owning it but everyone knows that looks ugly.
1 year ago
Anonymous
It does things for libido, fertility, mood and strength.
I will admit I don't know deeply about this topic, but every PED that is more strength oriented is a DHT derivative.
I understand that it's probably worth to nuke it if you're balding fully in your 20's. I am at the start of my 30's, and looking pretty well for my age, and I have none or potentially very minor male pattern balding. As said hard for me to tell because I never paid much attention. I won't cling on desperately to youth as I get older, ageing is a normal process.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Hair looking good at 31
Well there you go, you don't know what it's like. I'm 29 looking like Mr. Incredible and this shit is tanking my self-esteem.
>most non-mental sides from fin are probably from increased estrogen levels (less DHT conversion means more estrogen conversion after all)
Serum estrogen would be within normal daily fluctuations. You have to do something more drastic like inject testosterone to move estrogen levels. But DHT does have anti-estrogenic properties, i.e. nuking DHT will increase the potency of estrogen in tissues, even causing gyno.
Also DHT is most powerful in the brain and genitals. It's primary role is in male sexuality, so I think that's really the problem as some men are more neurologically dependent on DHT than others.
1 year ago
Anonymous
>Also DHT is most powerful in the brain
Neurosteroid production happens with DHT type 1 which is not affected by finasteride and dutasteride probably can't cross the BBB. > and genitals. >It's primary role is in male sexuality
No. The case studies used for the invention of finasteride followed boys who were born without the enzyme 5-AR type 2 and still developed normal penises during puberty with testosterone alone.
1 year ago
Anonymous
You don't need to guess with that kind of logic. Just observe what happens when DHT or DHT analogs are introduced. The effects are clear and reveal its role.
oh, look at that. it's another cope thread were people delude themsleves that taking a drug that not only inhibits the biosynthesis of the most potent male androgen but inhibits 5ar all over your body is somehow completely safe
kindly read this study:
https://wjmh.org/DOIx.php?id=10.5534/wjmh.200012
1. Finasteride and dutasteride induce liver lipid accumulation and steatosis
2. Finasteride and dutasteride induce insulin resistance and type 2 diabetes
3. Finasteride and dutasteride impair ocular function and cause development of dry eye disease
4. Adverse effects of finasteride and dutasteride on kidney function
"Inhibition of 5α-dihydrotestosterone biosynthesis induces a novel form of androgen deficiency independent of testosterone levels"
DHT is a trash hormone? these people have no shame
>t taking a drug that not only inhibits the biosynthesis of the most potent male androgen
DHT in blood serum is way too low to affect anything. While it may be 8x as powerful as testosterone, there's only 1/100th of the concentration of DHT in the blood as testosterone. You do the math. >but inhibits 5ar all over your body
Finasteride only inhibits type 2 and 3 5-AR which doesn't really have a role in an adult (nor even in children according to case studies).
"In men, inhibition of 5α-R types 1 and 2 with dutasteride resulted in hepatic IR, hepatic lipid accumulation, and decreased adipose lipid mobilization, without impacting peripheral insulin sensitivity [12, 16]. Insulin-regulated metabolites levels changed significantly in response to finasteride or dutasteride treatments. These findings suggest that 5α-R types 1 and 2 deficiencies or their pharmacological inhibition by finasteride or dutasteride contribute to IR and hepatic steatosis. In a population-based study, men with fatty livers had reduced relative excretion of 5α-reduced cortisol metabolites, resulting in liver fat accumulation [25]. Furthermore, protein expression of 5α-R types 1 in human liver correlates with features of steatohepatitis [14]."
"In addition to the well-recognized role of 5α-DHT and not total T in prostate growth and function, several other examples exist, which illustrate the key physiological role of 5α-DHT and not total T in mediating tissues function and metabolism. One such example is the role of 5α-DHT in maintaining erectile physiology [36]. It is now well-established that men treated with finasteride or dutasteride for BPH or AGA experience greater risk of erectile dysfunction, loss of libido and ejaculatory dysfunction [1, 7, 37, 38, 39]. These observations are strongly supported by studies in animal models, which demonstrated that finasteride and dutasteride, by inhibiting biosynthesis of 5α-DHT, impair corpus cavernosum growth and trabecular smooth muscle relaxation, endothelial function, increased connective tissue deposition and result in erectile dysfunction, even in the presence of physiological levels of total T "
Penile vascular abnormalities in young men with persistent side effects after finasteride use for the treatment of androgenic alopecia:
"A significant difference in total IIEF score between the 5ARI (median: 35; IQR: 29–43) and control group (median: 29; IQR: 27–32) (P=0.035) was observed. Seventeen 5ARI subjects (68%) had a vascular abnormality on PDDU. The median (IQR) for total IPSS score for the 5ARI group was 10 [5–16] compared to 3 [2–8] for the controls (P<0.01). The 5ARI group had a higher median total PHQ-9 score than controls [10 (6.5–16) vs. 1 (0–2) (P<0.001)]. Two subjects (8%) committed suicide during or after the study"
Isn't that the study from the PFS Foundation where they recruited their own forum members? And they didn't even describe what kind of abnormalities they found nor was this study randomiized or placebo-controlled.
hopefully more than the troony association that sponsers 'men' like you
Isn't that the study from the PFS Foundation where they recruited their own forum members? And they didn't even describe what kind of abnormalities they found nor was this study randomiized or placebo-controlled.
there was a control group. vascular abnormalities is pretty clear
went on fin at 30
even though I haven't noticed any side effects (or effects) literally why care if your dick works or doesn't past that
at least I can watch the people who are afraid of their dicks breaking seethe as they see my full head of hair and I see my reflection on their head
>Phase I
Yes well done it didn't kill anyone.
>CHINA
dont be so sure
>china solves baldness even though chinese people have lowest rates of hair loss
>whitoids still not grateful
We native Murricans never bald, Chinks bald plenty tho.
20% of younger Chinese men still have to deal with hairloss which is huge market.
This
>China literally carrying the future of western civilization through their hair restoring magic
>yakubian apes seeth, fume and mald while destroying their innocent balloons
The eternal whitoid
GT200029 might still go systemic and if it does the side effect profile would be way worse than any 5-ar inhibitor. Some people already report side effects on pyra/ru (heart, libido) despite both having low systemic absorbtion.
this literally kills the dht receptor right?if it went systemic it would be like a Fin Nuke,unparalleled to any Fin sides anyone has ever felt and would be permament.
It destroys androgen receptors, so for both testosterone and DHT. You obviously don't want that shit to go systemic since that would be equivalent to nuking both your DHT and testosterone levels.
>and would be permament.
The body would recover the androgen receptors in a few weeks but yeah it wouldn't be a good experience.
Holy shit then its true if Fin is conventional warfare to Balding we got the Nuclear Bomb of Balding holy shit
Imo most non-mental sides from fin are probably from increased estrogen levels (less DHT conversion means more estrogen conversion after all). Dut can also cause additional side effects because DHT type 1 is probably important in some bodily processes (fin doesn't inhibit type 1 DHT) but the side effect profile is still low, just like with fin.
If the new GT20029 drug doesn't go systemic, it would be a great additional to traditional 5-AR inhibitors and cause massive regrowth. But if it does go systemic, I wouldn't touch that stuff even with a long stick.
I would wait for a year AT MINIMUM after it comes out to the public
Yeah I got off fin after like a year and a half. Only took it once every 2 or 3 days. When I got off my athletic performance went up quite a bit. Also felt more adventurous, desire for going out and trying new things increased. Shit is fricked.
Everything is a risk reward calculation. I haven't had any issues with fin but even if I had, I would still take it because dealing with that is still preferable to looking into your mirror and seeing decay.
>Shit is fricked.
Nope, DHT is a based molecule.
I don't think I have the sensitivity genes. Hair looking good at 31. Never really tracked so hard to tell if there's a big difference from when I was 20. And even if, I'd accept it because DHT does so many other important things both mental and physical.
DHT, for the most part, is a trash hormone.
>I'd accept it because DHT does so many other important things both mental and physical.
Kevin Mann has an entire series where he trashes DHT with science.
With "science". Dude is deep in the cope zone. I get it, we all make sacrifices for vanity. But at least be man enough to own up to them
>With "science".
How are the studies he cites wrong? He's always using high quality randomized, placebo-controlled human studies.
>But at least be man enough to own up to them
Shaving it isn't owning up anything. Growing it out would be owning it but everyone knows that looks ugly.
It does things for libido, fertility, mood and strength.
I will admit I don't know deeply about this topic, but every PED that is more strength oriented is a DHT derivative.
I understand that it's probably worth to nuke it if you're balding fully in your 20's. I am at the start of my 30's, and looking pretty well for my age, and I have none or potentially very minor male pattern balding. As said hard for me to tell because I never paid much attention. I won't cling on desperately to youth as I get older, ageing is a normal process.
>Hair looking good at 31
Well there you go, you don't know what it's like. I'm 29 looking like Mr. Incredible and this shit is tanking my self-esteem.
>most non-mental sides from fin are probably from increased estrogen levels (less DHT conversion means more estrogen conversion after all)
Serum estrogen would be within normal daily fluctuations. You have to do something more drastic like inject testosterone to move estrogen levels. But DHT does have anti-estrogenic properties, i.e. nuking DHT will increase the potency of estrogen in tissues, even causing gyno.
Also DHT is most powerful in the brain and genitals. It's primary role is in male sexuality, so I think that's really the problem as some men are more neurologically dependent on DHT than others.
>Also DHT is most powerful in the brain
Neurosteroid production happens with DHT type 1 which is not affected by finasteride and dutasteride probably can't cross the BBB.
> and genitals.
>It's primary role is in male sexuality
No. The case studies used for the invention of finasteride followed boys who were born without the enzyme 5-AR type 2 and still developed normal penises during puberty with testosterone alone.
You don't need to guess with that kind of logic. Just observe what happens when DHT or DHT analogs are introduced. The effects are clear and reveal its role.
Putting shit on your head gets old fast. Do I think I’ll stick to fin
>Chinese research
>rub this drug that degrades androgen receptors into your skin
what could go wrong?
>Make you look like Stalin
Whats funny is that the Costanza actor has been wearing a wig in real life for the past 10 years
oh, look at that. it's another cope thread were people delude themsleves that taking a drug that not only inhibits the biosynthesis of the most potent male androgen but inhibits 5ar all over your body is somehow completely safe
kindly read this study:
https://wjmh.org/DOIx.php?id=10.5534/wjmh.200012
1. Finasteride and dutasteride induce liver lipid accumulation and steatosis
2. Finasteride and dutasteride induce insulin resistance and type 2 diabetes
3. Finasteride and dutasteride impair ocular function and cause development of dry eye disease
4. Adverse effects of finasteride and dutasteride on kidney function
"Inhibition of 5α-dihydrotestosterone biosynthesis induces a novel form of androgen deficiency independent of testosterone levels"
DHT is a trash hormone? these people have no shame
>t taking a drug that not only inhibits the biosynthesis of the most potent male androgen
DHT in blood serum is way too low to affect anything. While it may be 8x as powerful as testosterone, there's only 1/100th of the concentration of DHT in the blood as testosterone. You do the math.
>but inhibits 5ar all over your body
Finasteride only inhibits type 2 and 3 5-AR which doesn't really have a role in an adult (nor even in children according to case studies).
Read the study
Kevin Mann debunked the study. Dr. Trash falsely quotes other studies which even disprove his arguments.
just nerds seething at HWD-possessing athletic, big, dominant, DHT-havers.
>kindly read this study:
>Dr. Trash
Kevin Mann completely trashes this study.
finasteride is a legit cult. you guys are in too deep
Going bald means giving up and being defeatist.
Taking finasteride means taking your destiny into your own hands.
>1
dont care
>2
dont care
>3
dont care
>4
dont care
yeah sorry, too many words
Haircafe is a loony and Koreans will solve hair loss with follicle cloning
"In men, inhibition of 5α-R types 1 and 2 with dutasteride resulted in hepatic IR, hepatic lipid accumulation, and decreased adipose lipid mobilization, without impacting peripheral insulin sensitivity [12, 16]. Insulin-regulated metabolites levels changed significantly in response to finasteride or dutasteride treatments. These findings suggest that 5α-R types 1 and 2 deficiencies or their pharmacological inhibition by finasteride or dutasteride contribute to IR and hepatic steatosis. In a population-based study, men with fatty livers had reduced relative excretion of 5α-reduced cortisol metabolites, resulting in liver fat accumulation [25]. Furthermore, protein expression of 5α-R types 1 in human liver correlates with features of steatohepatitis [14]."
"In addition to the well-recognized role of 5α-DHT and not total T in prostate growth and function, several other examples exist, which illustrate the key physiological role of 5α-DHT and not total T in mediating tissues function and metabolism. One such example is the role of 5α-DHT in maintaining erectile physiology [36]. It is now well-established that men treated with finasteride or dutasteride for BPH or AGA experience greater risk of erectile dysfunction, loss of libido and ejaculatory dysfunction [1, 7, 37, 38, 39]. These observations are strongly supported by studies in animal models, which demonstrated that finasteride and dutasteride, by inhibiting biosynthesis of 5α-DHT, impair corpus cavernosum growth and trabecular smooth muscle relaxation, endothelial function, increased connective tissue deposition and result in erectile dysfunction, even in the presence of physiological levels of total T "
Why are you still citing Dr. Trash (an Indian btw)? Guy can't even correctly quote his own sources.
debooonk this my dear fintroonys
https://tau.amegroups.com/article/view/39898/html
Penile vascular abnormalities in young men with persistent side effects after finasteride use for the treatment of androgenic alopecia:
"A significant difference in total IIEF score between the 5ARI (median: 35; IQR: 29–43) and control group (median: 29; IQR: 27–32) (P=0.035) was observed. Seventeen 5ARI subjects (68%) had a vascular abnormality on PDDU. The median (IQR) for total IPSS score for the 5ARI group was 10 [5–16] compared to 3 [2–8] for the controls (P<0.01). The 5ARI group had a higher median total PHQ-9 score than controls [10 (6.5–16) vs. 1 (0–2) (P<0.001)]. Two subjects (8%) committed suicide during or after the study"
Isn't that the study from the PFS Foundation where they recruited their own forum members? And they didn't even describe what kind of abnormalities they found nor was this study randomiized or placebo-controlled.
>debooonk this my dear fintroonys
Easy. I've been on Fin for years now. My penis works great and my boners are rock hard.
How much does the Bald Head Association pay you to write these little fanfics?
hopefully more than the troony association that sponsers 'men' like you
there was a control group. vascular abnormalities is pretty clear
They literally have now shown if it's effective or not. Wait
went on fin at 30
even though I haven't noticed any side effects (or effects) literally why care if your dick works or doesn't past that
at least I can watch the people who are afraid of their dicks breaking seethe as they see my full head of hair and I see my reflection on their head