I am convinced this lift is a complete psyop. No matter how I position my feet, how much I move my knees forward or where I position the bar, my form always sucks. I can't keep the bar path straight and over midfoot, my back leans forward, and I end up with back pain afterwards. It's been months now that I've been trying to learn this lift but it still doesn't click. Elevating my heels helps, but doesn't solve it. Are squats literally impossible to perform correctly? What can you do if you get filtered by the most basic exercise?
>the most basic exercise
squats are the most complex out of all the compound movements you moron, maybe the issue is your brain
>squats are the most complex out of all the compound movements
They are basic in the sense that they are foundational, they're a part of every program, used in every sport, and should be natural to the human body. That's why I feel incredibly moronic for failing to do them.
>Are you doing high or low bar?
High bar
>Can you do bodyweight squats to depth?
not without leaning my back a lot
>Any issues with your back or hip flexibility?
No clue. I'm an otherwise healthy adult, no pain or anything.
What about ankles?
Do you feet stay on the ground, or do you end up on your toes?
his ankle mobility is probably bad
>Elevating my heels helps
You lack ankle and hamstring/hip mobility to do a high bar squat to the depth you are attempting. You probably also don't know how to brace and have poor kineasthetic sense in general but more importantly in your upper back and core.
1. Stop trying to go ass to grass.
2. Learn a low bar position, or at least lower.
3. Invest in a pair of weightlifting shoes.
4. Most importantly, learn how to brace.
I see you in the gym all the time. Stiff lanklets who try to go ATG high bar in flat heels or socks, their lumbar is always rounded near the bottom position. The vast majority of people are not built to do that, start with a low bar to parallel following the points above and then if you want to work on the mobility to attain a weightlifting style squat.
Are you doing high or low bar?
Can you do bodyweight squats to depth?
Any issues with your back or hip flexibility?
Everyone at every level is viable to get it wrong. Experiment. But even then, chances are you're doing something fundamentally wrong.
just do hack squat moron
>I am convinced this lift is a complete psyop.
It isn't , don't worry.
>No matter how I position my feet, how much I move my knees forward or where I position the bar, my form always sucks.
Maybe try to keep it simple and don't overthink it. I assume as most of everybody who has ever been on IST has teached "the big three" lifts and other lifts each one on his own, without paying for a luxurious personal trainer. In my case I have been in a total of three different gyms and when doing squats or deadlifts I have had other gym bros (or complete strangers) sometimes (with or without asking them) spotting me and coming to me and telling me to correct this or that if they saw my form was below optimum, so I wouldn't get injured. But besides that I have learned every single lift on my own through the all the info available on the internet: text, images and videos. Actually reading the Starting Strength book and also the wiki of it has teached me the most. By trial and error, I can take time, depending of how fast you understand from the basics to the most little yet important details, obviously. But eventually you will get it. And eventually totally dominate the technique.
>I can't keep the bar path straight and over midfoot, my back leans forward, and I end up with back pain afterwards. It's been months now that I've been trying to learn this lift but it still doesn't click. Elevating my heels helps, but doesn't solve it.
>Are squats literally impossible to perform correctly?
No.
How fat are you? or you are just moronic. I used to do squats 5 times a week and never got back pain. (This is when I started my lifting journey)
You were probably half squatting light weight
It's not flexibility. Rippetoe says he's almost never run into anyone where flexibility was the limitation.
>almost
okay so he's run into at least one. a thread like this one in relation to squats is extremely rare, so maybe opie is that guy.
I can't do regular squats either for some reason. I have to do front squats.
>What can you do if you get filtered by the most basic exercise?
I get this with bench. I try to clench my upper back, raise my lower back and that all feels fine but I think I subconsciously let my wrists slip or something because I'll sometimes get pain in one of my wrists the next day. I guess I'm kind of twisting them in or something
>What can you do if you get filtered by the most basic exercise?
Study the exercise. Read and watch info available in books or the internet (filter garbage sources like many wannabe "PTs" you will see on sites like youtube, or websites for women, etc., and actually understand what muscles do squats work/activate during the lift, which joints move during the movemen. Try to understand the anatomy of the human body even. And I don't think it is the most basic exercise, by the way.
Personally I have, for example, gathered good info from good different sources, like mainly the SS book and wiki (if you can't afford the book at least download it for free in PDF). Allan Thrall tutorial on squats (both low-bar and high-bad), among other sources I can't specifically remember right now.
Your back leaning forward can be pretty bad I think, you're prone to a spine injury or something depending on the amount of weight and how terrible or not-so-bad your form is.
Basically squats (high-bar at least, which are the ones I do, despite SS tells you to do because I wanted stronger quads, and DIDN'T want a bigger ass that looks feminine and disproportionate with the rest of your body, consist in the following steps:
-First of all put the bar at the correct height in relation to your height, can't remember where it should be exactly ideally but well look it up yourself. If you stand straight the bar in front of you it should be at a height that is a little lower than your traps on the rack. (If you think about it logically you should be able to deduce this by yourself anyway).
-A step forwards, then another, now you are under the bar.
-Grab the bar.
-Stand up until your traps touch the bar.
-Feet width should be about a just a bit wider than your shoulder width.
-Feet pointing outwards so it forms an angle of 30° imagining a vertical line starting at your heel and an inclined line following the direction your feet are pointing to.
-Hands width/hands position: not too long but not too narrow neither, so something in-between that. Can't remember the exact position. I would say concentrate and feel it. It should be a grab width enough to already contract your traps moderately. But not to the point it feels uncomfortable, or else the whole lift, each rep will be harder than squats already are.
-Proceed to un-rack the bar.
-You're now standing with straight posture (always maintain it) with the bar placed on your traps. Un-racking it and supporting it is nothing (otherwise, you should be using less weight) because you're about to squat that weight for reps.
-Now a step behind, another step behind, so your feet are aligned again but away from the power-rack. (look down and move them carefully and position them right quickly if they are not).
-Concentrate, breathe-in as deep as possible and simply sit down maintaining posture (go as below as possible, you will gain mobility with each workout and get able to go lower more and more
-When you hit the lowest your mobility allows you, immediately, like explosively, stand up.
-Remember to hold your breath UNTIL you are standing up and have hit a certain height that's where you can start breathing out until you full stand up.
-Repeat.
*Note: Do not use running shoes. Either do it with flat shoes like skate shoes or the good old All Star Chuck Taylor's, or just simply barefoot
This is a video of me squatting about 140 or 150 kg but only for 1RM because that day I felt tired and hadn't eaten well before going to gym:
https://streamable.com/iqvho4
Cheat a bit then, step with your heels on something, but not too high. 2 of the small weight discs could do
Skill issue
Do them wide
And additionally do Hindu squats for reps
The problem with the squat is that it's a lift entirely dependable on your body structure. No 2 squats look the same the same way no 2 fingerprints look the same. The way you squat is entirely dependent on your own personal body type. Looking up squatting tips on YouTube has done more hard to fitness that any other fad
I got to 240kg squat and every rep felt fricked. Didn't have pain or anything, but it always felt wrong. Never got back pain, but still.
This helped a lot:
Do it off a box because it lets you pause a second and remember the cues. Box is also easier on the back and harder on the legs. Stack plates if your gym doesn't have a box. Keep your shins perfectly vertical at all times. You'll feel your quads anyway but you need to learn to keep the movement in the hips.
Do a bunch of singles/doubles forcing yourself to do every rep perfectly. Then do a technically easy variation like zerchers or even just leg press or whatever for the actual reps/sets.
I have great difficulty in performing squats because I have long femurs, normal tibias, and a manlet torso :'(
But anyway, I've made breakthroughs in the past year and here is what has helped me
>Mobility
Stretch it all out before you put load on your back. Stretch your hips out by doing air squats and sitting at the bottom of an air squats and rock a little to the side to open them up. Then stretch out your hammies by doing a thot squat: grab your ankles, pull yourself down while trying to keep a neutral spine (well, minimize rounding as much as you can more like), and then stand up and back while holding your ankles or feet so that you're straight legged, then come back down, do a few times, and rest. Over a few "sets" of this, your hamstrings should get looser. Lastly, ankles, hip abductors, and knees. Just kneel on one leg and push out to the side the same way you would in a squat, focus on keeping knees tracking with toes out and angle and then push forward as much as you can while staying balanced and tight in the back (that is to say, don't let your back and core go flat and loose). If you have tight shoulders/upper back, stretch that too I guess but I'm fine there so can't give ya many tips in that department.
>Actually squatting
Get under the bar, get in on your back where it's comfortable and you can get it tight. Low, high, stop overthinking it and just put it where it naturally feels alright once you're braced. Pick it up with your forearms roughly tracking with your torso, think about squeezing your armpits together, that helps me keep my elbows pinned without actually compromising my upper back stability by pinning them ifykwim. Anyway, inhale into your diaphragm and push out in 360°. Basically, push into your obliques or imagine someone picking you up like a toddler: they'd grab your waist and where they'd grab you is where you should be trying to expand air to. Then glutes push forward and quads push up to unrack, so (cont.)
try leg press with a nearly full rom and work on your mobility: hips, quads, ankles, glutes
I guarantee if you posted a video it would be very clear that you lack the flexibility to perform the movement properly
Pic related. Just elevate your heels and you don’t need to go all the way down. Thanks to israelites we can’t discuss genetic differences now. Some people will never be able to squat deeply without causing pain and joint problems. There is literally no reason you HAVE to squat other than some tryhard manlet saying so.
>I am convinced this lift is a complete psyop. No matter how I position my feet, how much I move my knees forward or where I position the bar, my form always sucks. I can't keep the bar path straight and over midfoot, my back leans forward, and I end up with back pain afterwards
same. I was lifting for years before a very long break and had the same issue. technically managed to get it into intermediate strength standards for my weight, but it was barely more than my bench. recently got back to lifting and it's even worse. highbar is basically impossible for me and I have very good ankle mobility and can touch my ass with my heels while maintaining a straight back without any weight. it's a bit better with lowbar
Squats are a natural movement that anyone can do if they aren't an immobile lardass who has neglected themselves for decades. You are like a little baby, except actual babies can't properly squat. Forget the barbell for a couple weeks. Do deep rounded bodyweight squats throughout the day whenever you can until you don't suck. Do it waiting in line, at your job, in your desk chair, when eating. You should be able to fall asleep squatting.
>can't properly
can properly
dumb advice, how you body weight squat can be very different from how you would do a barbell squat
I can sit in a full slav squat, I wouldn't put 3pl8 on my back and go into that position
There's no better way to force ankle mobity to improve. Obviously you don't want a rounded back and buttwink with a weighted squat, but that should be obvious enough. Best for op to start with the basics and improve one thing at a time.
Olympic bar only (20kg)
No ankle elevation
Jump
Whatever position and distance your feet fell, keep them at that
Squat as deep as you can
Hold for 5-10 seconds
EXPLODE upwards and jump
Repeat
Practice that until you can go ass to grass for 10 reps
Increase weight
yes squats are for fatass powershitters good job figuring that out now hop on the leg press