Been on that keto for 2 years now and lost a bunch of weight then basically maintained for a while before I started working out and actually counted calories and macros for cutting purposes the last 3 months or so. I'm at the point where I've decided I'm just way too exhausted every day at work and then working out after to continue, even though I know I haven't even made it past 15%, I'm gonna try a bulk for the first time on October 9th (Canadian Thanksgiving). I plan to do it not keto, but I'm just wondering what's the best way to come off keto into a bulk without just putting on a tonne of fat. How long to do it for, and the best possible routine I could do given my starting point? I've been cutting around 1500cals for these three months. I only have a home gym as well with dumbbells and a half rack/barbell. I have been thinking of checking out the gym here but its a small town, the gym is not big and guaranteed to be completely packed basically any time I could even go there.
>yes I know, I have the gyno with a pretty non existent chest, and wide hips
Simple. Just eat more than what you'd eat for maintenance.
Well that much I know, but like how much more and what types of food given that I've been on keto for the last 2 years straight? Basically my mind is stuck on the the keto shit. Should I ease into it do you think? On Thanksgiving I'm definitely just eating whatever the hell my grandma makes though.
Eat around 250kcal above maintainence. Putting on half a pound per week is the slowest you can gain weight while maximizing muscle gain. Bias towards more protein if you're not tracking it right now.
>I know I haven't even made it past 15%
You're delusional. You're like 11% bodyfat with only a bit more muscle than average. That's why your energy is in the toilet.
I do track protein. I have been getting minimum 180-200+ a day for the three months I started tracking/cutting. Mostly eggs, chicken, and tuna since I ate the same thing every single day. I think hitting the protein goal will be pretty easy for me. I was planning on switching to steak and ground beef mostly for meat.
GYATT DAYM dude you do not need that much protein. What are you like 140 pounds? 140g a day is already covering your bases and most would be getting by fine with like 120g at your size. The frick
Those scales can swing 7 or 8 percent in either direction. You're much leaner than your scale is claiming. When you actually start eating enough you'll feel a lot better and your lifts will shoot up compared to when you were cutting
I'm 175 in that picture at 6'.
I really hope this is true. I feel like my body is giving out before it should during my workouts, and at work I'm just so pissed off and angry about everything so easily, when I used not give a shit about anything and be care free.
>body is giving out before it should during my workouts
Yeah you need more energy, carbs, before your lifts.
I know it's not the most accurate but my scale says I'm 15.8%. Either way I do think I was eating too little which was leading to the exhaustion since I work a manual labour job, but I'm still done with it for now and would rather try to actually gain some muscle since my lifts suck.
those scales are very bad at tracking actual bodyfat, what they are good for is tracking trends. You look 10-11% bodyfat. This is Omar Isuf DEXA scanned at 12%.
>without just putting on a tonne of fat
Tricky but possible. You want to be about 200 calories above maintenance (a little less than 2lbs per month), and you should try to get your calories by percentage of: 45% carbs, 35% protein, 20% fats.
If you lift with enough intensity, you'll start to see results faster than you'd expect.
That little fat for a bulk? I have no idea, so I'll try whatever and see how it goes. I would have though I'd want more fat on a bulk though. What would your fat % look like on a cut?
>That little fat for a bulk?
Yes, you really don't need much to grow slowly. Your body needs lipids for cell membranes and hormones, and the majority of the energy will come from carbs. I only advocate that much fat because less will make you feel hungry constantly and can frick up your perceived energy levels.
I suggest eating the most of your carbs a couple hours before the gym, and the rest normally through the day, but less towards night for better sleep.
Alright, I'm gonna write those %'s down and see how it goes.
>less towards the night for better sleep
I noticed on keto my sleep has been complete shit for these two years, and the only thing that made it better was eating most if not all my carbs before bed. But I'll try that out too since I'll be running on carbs normally now. This ones probably obvious but should I stop IF while bulking? I always did IF just because it was easier to not eat while I was at work and save my calories, which meant I ended up always working out fasted too, so I imagine I should be bringing food to work now to keep a steady flow of energy to burn through basically?
Go full carnivore. Don't count calories. You may gain subcutaneous fat, but it'll go away in few months
>CUT
You should not be starting out your muscle gaining phase too fat. Males should be at 10-12% (19-24% for women) body fat before even considering going on any kind of ‘bulk’. If you're at 15% body fat (about 24-27% for women) or more you should diet down first and you’ll be in an overall better position to gain mass.
>BULK
Only try to add mass/bulk until you hit the top end body fat percentage. So that’s about 15% body fat for men and 24-27% body fat for women. What this would mean in practice is that you diet to 10-12% body fat for men (22-24% for women), eat at maintenance for two weeks to try and normalize things, and then add mass until you hit 15% body fat for men (22-24% for women) and then diet back down. Over a number of cycles, you should be able to increase your muscle mass while keeping body fat under control.
>KETOgay COMPLICATIONS
For coming off keto I would recommend taking two weeks at roughly maintenance calories with 100-150 grams per day of carbohydrate. The reasons for this are numerous but revolve around letting some of the physiological and hormonal adaptations normalize. Leptin, thyroid, SNS output should improve a bit, along with other hormones, putting you in a better place to gain mass without super excessive fat gain.
I'm not saying keto doesn't work, it clearly does for some, but it's a total frick-around in the context of cycling through cutting and mass-gaining phases. Stick to Calories-In/Calories-Out and manage your macros. You will not gain mass without carbs.
Of course you would already know all of this if you had READ THE FRICKING STICKY.
I know the basics of a bulk, and why I thought I shouldn't bulk yet as my scale was saying 15.8%. More so curious on timing of carbs and things like that, or what types of carbs to eat and how many since I've been keto for so long and never bulked before. I will definitely try to eat at roughly maintenance for a week or two for these hormonal adaptions. That does seem like a good idea.
What do you recommend as a good preworkout meal. I generally workout when I get home from work around 3:30, so my preworkout meal would either be during my drive home at 2:30 or at 12. Something like fruits for carbs or would something like rice be better for a preworkout carb?
This is how I figured I'd go about it at first to see what happens.
I planned to bulk not on keto. So it seems from what everyones saying to slowly introduce them back in and eat at maintenance for a bit before going into a surplus.
most calculators tell me my tdee is 2500-2800, I don't know how accurate that is. I weigh 175lbs at 6'. I work as a drywaller 5 days a week and workout 5-6 days for 1hour-1hour and a half. Weekends I usually help out at gf's family farm in the fields.
>what types of carbs
Starchy and/or fibrous carbs. Potatoes, brown rice, wholegrain bread, beans, oats, bananas etc. Avoid sugars as much as possible.
>how many
100-150g
>timing
I don't know. I eat carbs (usually oats) around an hour before I lift and eat more carbs with protein (usually bananas and a shake) around an hour after I lift. Is that correct? I don't know or care.
Just plan out a 2500 calorie diet and eat that every day for a few months and see what happens. Don't pig out. Treat it like you are still on a diet.
If you're going to bulk on keto you'll really need to step up calorie intake. You'll probably have oily shits, but it'll be what your body is used to. It's doable but not as easy as bulking on carbs.
If you want to not do keto for bulking, slowly shift your diet back into more carb intake so your body actually figures out how to absorb them again. Eat your normal keto diet and supplement carbs up to your bulking caloric count, basically.
Macros should be 1g protein per pound of bodyweight, 250 calories above maintenance, with 30% of you calories coming from fat. Since I don't know how much you weigh or what your TDEE is, I can't calculate this for you. How many carbs you need to eat will depend on how much cardio you do.
>30% of you calories coming from fat.
Can you source this for me anon? I don't not believe you, I would just like some further reading on macro ratios
Every part of what he just said is absolute horse shit