Often when we talk about Mentzer and his advices we have people who come and tell us that he invented everything after the Olympia in 1980
Others anons pretend that he advocated for the volume/frequency method since the early 70's
So, did he really use his own advices or everything is bullshit and made up after his failed career?
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he trained from 79 to 80 using his Heavy Duty principles.
So he trained with his method when 95% of his physique was already built?
Most bodybuilders increased muscle mass after plateauing using that method so I would say that it is wrong to look at it like that
>mogged by Arnie
I'm tired of the same samegay making the same Mentzer thread and samegayging it.
no. Body built with roids.
So, what's the verdict? Low volume high frequency is optimal, or no?
I don't know fren, there are so many informations and studies that often contradict each others
FWIW running HIT, I feel doms in my worked muscles for 1-2 days after the workout and numbers are going up in terms of reps and weight moved.
Didn't have that with normie high-volume.
optimal is whatever keeps you going back to the gym and enjoying it. At the end of the day, just consistently lifting, eating, and sleeping are going to get you 95% of the way there.
high volume high frequency high roids is optimal
Whatever frequency you need to recover & grow
Whatever volume is enough to stimulate growth
It's individual
Here are my leg days with strict heavy duty protocol leg days. I hit them every 13-15 days and only one set leg press and leg extension for quads. I’m happy so far with my legs especially after years trying to build them. good luck op
they look small
they've been way smaller than this. And i only weight 163lbs so i don't think they can be any bigger at my weight especially when that im cutting right now. But yeah thanks for your input
They look nice, especially if it is an fast improvement. They still could be a bit bigger but to say those quads are small is mental illness
How do you warm up to that 1 set?
>They look nice
thanks
>warm up
basically a very light set of 6 reps on the leg press, then one really light set of leg ext of maybe 5-7 reps.
Then i take my towel and set it on the leg press. Then i start my one set of leg extention while blasting my playlist while really focusing on locking in (you get one set per week so go all in), set will take 45sec to 1m then run to leg press and superset there and try to get more than 5 reps or beat last's week pr, if i fail the pr i do dropsets. Then i rest a litle and i go to leg curls and calves. This takes me 30 mins max
your quads are small, you are just very lean. Kneecap to muscle gives it away instantly.
Post legs.
>lean
dude im like 15% and my upper is not that even impressive, yes they are not big but they are way bigger than last year where i was spamming squats and doing high volume.
really? sounds impossible are you doing triples only?
My legs are the same size and I squat 4pl8s for reps.
>victim weight roidtroony
cant get worse than that lmao
>he invented everything after the Olympia in 1980
No. Arthur Jones did in the late 60's. Sergio Oliva even trained for HIT under Arthur Jones for 1972 Mr. Olympia and incorporated some of the principles into his personal routine afterwords. Boyar Coe was another who trained with Arthur Jones and had some success with it. There was also Ellington Darden who had his HIT routines.
Mike learned about HIT from Casey Viator and did it throughout the 70's after losing to Casey Viator. Pic related is his "most productive routine" which he used to train. He would take a 1-3 days between workouts. The later "Heavy Duty routine" was just Mike's approach to the routine. He had his original routine which was a twice per week AB routine. Then in Heavy Duty, he introduced a PPL routine. Heavy Duty II is when he introduced his "ideal routine." The picture you see floating around is with some changes John Little introduced, notably changing the rep range on leg day for squats/leg press from 6-10 to 12-20. Heavy Duty II has you do 6-10 on the leg compounds. The ideal routine itself was more along the lines of a intermediate routine and allowed for shorter rest periods for people who could train more frequently and longer who couldn't. Then there was the consolidation program which was supposed to be used for the true hardgainers and extremely advanced lifters who milked everything they could get from other programs and really just needed an abbreviated program.
Mike is just the biggest advocate of HIT principles within bodybuilding before Dorian Yates.
The PPL routine from Heavy Duty. This was about a three day/week program.
so that's like training every 48 hours? sets/reps?
pic related
Also, only one set is recommend for each exercise.
wow thanks had no idea these templates existed.
I'm doing the ideal routine for alomost 3 months already and im barely recovering for how hard the sessions became that i'm even taking 7 days rest from workout to workout.
also pic rel is it for the ppl or the x2 full body one? The 'ideal routine' is upper lower so ppl sounds like a good idea to break the monotony of the program but im considering doing in after taking 2 weeks off at least because im exhausted right now. what does he say about dropsets and rest pause?
That is for the PPL routine. The two-day split has the sets and reps listed.
I'm considering it now that i have off season from work until march, did you try it? frequency and volume is way higher than ideal routine.
>what does he say about dropsets and rest pause?
Mike likes rest/pause given that you use a weight you can only do one more rep with in perfect form after about a 10 second rest.
Mike doesn't like drop sets as a way to just do more reps after going to failure by using an arbitrarily lower weight. However, drop sets are still useful. If you hit failure with too few reps, say you could only do 4-5 reps with a selected weight, if you are able to quickly decrease the weight like on a selectorized machine and then use it to get back into your rep range, that's fine.
you have trouble recovering precisely because you take so much rest.
peak recovery is 72 hours, after that you get DOMS, and the longer your break is the harder DOMS hit.
>you have trouble recovering precisely because you take so much rest.
The ability to recover after exercise depends on how intense your exercise is. Lower intensity = less recovery time necessary (i.e. you can go for a jog or long walk every day). Higher Intensity = more recovery time necessary.
>peak recovery is 72 hours
The amount of time it takes to recover varies from individual to individual. Some people need more time. Others need less.
>after that you get DOMS
You get doms the next day after your workout. Not after 72 hours.
>The ability to recover after exercise depends on how intense your exercise is. Lower intensity = less recovery time necessary (i.e. you can go for a jog or long walk every day). Higher Intensity = more recovery time necessary.
Intensity in that sense just means how heavy it is, it's not how hard you work. Someone whose deadlift max is 160kg could spam sets of 5 @ 90% almost every day if they wanted, but if their max were 350kg that would kill them inside 3 or 4 days.
Intensity is intensity of effort; how hard your muscles have to work. The heavier the weight, the harder your muscles have to work. The closer to failure you go, the harder your muscles have to work. The more consistently, your muscles are under tension, the harder your muscles have to work. Making sure your negatives are slow make your muscles have to work even harder. Put all that together and you have what HIT is all about. Pushing your muscles to work as hard as you can possibly get them to.
>deadlift
>3 or 4 days.
Consider how much more your muscles will have to work if you add a slow negative to the end of each rep for a deadlift as opposed to performing it in the conventional manner with the weight dropped at the end of each rep. You would have to rest even longer.
>lying french presses
relax with a coffee, nice.
>be a roid troony
>lie to a bunch of fat fricks that they only have to lift for 20 minutes
>sell your lies
>buy meth
>repeat
Normies:
>OH MY GAWD YOURE TELLING ME THAT BARELY WORKING OUT IS BASED AND REDPILLED COUNTERCULTURE??? YES I LOVE CURRENT FAD SO BASED GRINDSET
I've literally had underweight zoomers tell me "nah bro you only need 1 set a week per muscle group if you know how to train to failure" as if they had experience or authority on the subject nope they watched some cringy tiktok edit about this roider
yes
Dorian Yates Blood & Guts.
Warming up on the treadmill before a lift is just stupid
why
>rotator cuff warmup
This is actually a fair amount of volume. It's really not just 20 mins in and out. Since presumably you're doing heavy ass weights to failure every working set, you're also resting at least 3-5 mins between sets.
With the warm-up sets and rests it would take longer than bros I have who do a typical one muscle group only bodypart split daily. They are usually in and out in a hour.
Over time the actual volume in terms of how long you are in the gym for really wouldn't be that much lower than someone doing a typical bro split with no or little warm up sets imho.
And since you are lifting heavy as frick compared to some teen on a bro split you probably would get better size as well as strength as a natty even though it's proponents in pro bodybuilding famously did more raids than anyone else.
yates only spent 4 hours a week in the gym
Of course not. He built it with roids.
unflexxed arnold is way bigger than flexed and posed metzBlack person topkek
honestly Mentzer has the kind of body I would be happy with.
Not big but not tiny either
>Not big
Not big by bodybuilding standards
Yes and he used lots of meth as preworkout
Meth is the preworkout of legends.
No. Mentzer himself said that he's main mistake was not following his own advice
>Take 10 years worth of steroids a week
>Start shitting out the worst diet / exercise routines imaginable
>People actually believe it and start following the shat out memes
Bodybuilding never changes.
52 sets.
It's proven to be scientifically optimal for hypertrophy.
Go take meth mentzerheads
no he didn't and neither did yates
I didn't know mike personally so i can't answer your question. i use hit for upper body. it works well.
They would look like shit without roids.
He absolutely built his physique with high volume traditional bodybuilding methods. Same with Dorian Yates. They made the changes AFTER they were already professional bodybuilders. What self deceiving HIT morons won’t accept is that you need to be a very good bodybuilder ALREADY and be on gear for HIT to work. Do one set for chest an week including drop sets and what not as a natty: guess what you’re going to look like shit. Do one set of chest with an outstanding mind muscle connection and years of lifting experience plus steroids: you’re probably going to be stronger when you try it again next week. Still not ideal but it can definitely work. As a beginner/intermediate or as a natty (which applies to the vast majority of people here and indeed everywhere) it’s just a way for absolute morons to tell themselves akshually I should do less work to get better results
>you need to be a very good bodybuilder ALREADY and be on gear for HIT to work.
Why?
>do less work
my brainlet friend, if you think you're doing more work because you have 20 sets of junk volume as opposed to 2 sets of high intensity that are guaranteed to trigger muscle growth, then you are and will never ngmi
everyone should watch this video to see the types of people he trains. if you get mogged by his trainee, - which, let's face it, this is IST, everyone itt will get mogged - then stfu
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eat clen tren hard anavar give up!